Sonny Software

Would it be possible to have the option of opening multiple windows for the same library that could show different database entries, in the same way that Mail.app allows one to open multiple Viewer windows? That would address most of my concerns, since I could keep one small for data entry and one larger for browsing or searching my library.

I know I can open the PDF in the lower pane, but then I'm either resizing my Bookends Library window and pane, or working with a very small text. With a PDF open in Preview, I can have the PDF at a size that's easily legible, without resizing anything. I've long been a fan of applications that do a few things, do them well, and interact well with other applications, rather than the all-in-one approach that too often leads to bloat. I think the Unix pipe is elegant and preferred mh to mail or Pine for my email back in my college days.

I don't want to come off as an old-fashioned curmudgeon; I like a lot of the redesign, including the new icon, and appreciate your efforts to keep the program, which is essential to me, up to date.

Having multiple windows where you can edit references is a nonstarter. There are way too many problems with that approach. Having multiple read-only windows is a possibility, but I can see that being a mess as well. Of course, you can always have Bookends open the PDF in your preferred PDF reader with a click if you want a separate window...

Jon
Sonny Software

Jon wrote:Having multiple windows where you can edit references is a nonstarter. There are way too many problems with that approach.

Ah, well, so it goes. I thought I'd ask since DEVONthink Pro, OmniFocus, and a few other applications I use offer the feature. Read-only windows would unnecessarily complicate things for most users, I would think.

Thanks again for your replies!

I'm sad the separate reference window is gone. I liked that a lot and used it.

I lost all my static groups at the base level but not in folders, and when I tried to open my backup it crashed, removing everything. And apparently however Dropbox backs stuff up couldn't do it right, as Bookends won't open the previous version.

The issue with groups has been fixed, along with some other problems that have shown up. I'll make a silent update this evening and notify the forum. Bookends 12.5 has no problems opening earlier versions -- if you're having a problem please write to tech support (support@sonnysoftwar.com) and include your database, zipped.

Jon
Sonny Software

Jon wrote:Note that pressing tab will also take you through the fields and automatically scroll.

Also, if you're only editing one field, the Concise view works well for that.

Jon
Sonny Software

That helps, I had forgotten about it.

I have just noticed a strange behaviour when changing data manually in the right reference pane (it might have been present in the versions before, but I am not sure):
- when I click on the title of a field a window opens with the input of that field. After editing and saving, the font size shrinks, but at the same time, in the preview pane the size of the text corresponding to this field grows (from 13 point, the default, to 15).
- however, when I leave this reference entry and switch later back to it, the text in the changed field has grown (again, 15 instead of 13)
- I have not tested all fields and all reference types, but this applies at least to the fields "Title", "Book title" and "Year" in the reference type "Book chapter" and "Journal". However, it does not happen with "Authors" or "Pages" (in a way: the preview shows 13 points, but the text in the fields is clearly larger as well).

- as a side note: Would it be possible to have scroll bars for the fields "Title", "Ser Title" and "Book Title"?

Cheers,

Nils

Would you please send screen snaps to tech support so we can see exactly what you're talking about? (support@sonnysoftware.com).

And yes, I'll add a vertical scrollbar to that field.

Jon
Sonny Software

There might be no need for scrollbar as the two-finger movement already works for any field.

Request: add one more line to series and vol as these fields contain long titles and it would be nice to see them in their entirety rather than having to scroll.

While I understand the need to modernize the interface, for me the loss of the separate reference window reduces functionality. I would frequently have a PDF open in an Acrobat window or on a web page and then have the reference window open in the upper right corner. This would leave quite a bit of real estate available on the screen to display the PDF. I could then be reading from the PDF to enter the data into the fields in the reference dialog box. Now my entire Bookends window is open, leaving very little real estate on the screen to display the PDF. While I realize that I can look at the PDF in the attachment pane below the library, it is much less real estate. For me, you have definitely reduced the utility of the program and limited the degrees of freedom in which I can use the program. Joel

You can still have the PDF open in Acrobat or a browser. You can close the lower pane in the Bookends window if you like and make the reference pane as wide as you wish (within reason). I don't see how this is any different from using the standalone window with Acrobat/browser display of a PDF.

Jon
Sonny Software

Jon wrote:You can still have the PDF open in Acrobat or a browser. You can close the lower pane in the Bookends window if you like and make the reference pane as wide as you wish (within reason). I don't see how this is any different from using the standalone window with Acrobat/browser display of a PDF.

The difference (which I was attempting to convey earlier) is that focus has to be in the Bookends window when entering data. But if one clicks in the Bookends window, the whole window comes to the foreground and covers much of the PDF. I've attached two screenshots showing the difference. With the standalone Reference window, the Bookends window got focus but the PDF, in the first background layer, was still completely visible.

Before: After:

Yes, I see your point. But you've made the Bookends window very wide. You could lessen the width considerably have the reference pane take up the majority of the window. In fact the resulting window can be almost the same width as the old standalone window you're showing in the image.

I have had an idea, though, that might deal with the issues that some people are bringing up. The problem with the old window, besides being none-too-pretty, was that it was a completely self-sufficient way of dealing with the data, including formatting, drag and drop or otherwise attaching PDFs, managing the Inspector, handling scanning, and all of the thousands of things Bookends does. In fact, although most people probably don't realize it, you could do almost everything the Bookends does without ever opening the library window! That's how Bookends used to work. And it became an albatross.

However, it's possible that I could restore a simple separate edit window that could be invoked instead of the edit pane (just like before). It would only let you view/edit info -- that it would be, basically, the edit pane you see now in its own window.

I'll think about this (there are some tricky issues I'd have to deal with). But at first blush it might satisfy those who miss the old standalone window.

Jon
Sonny Software

Jon thanks for considering some form of reference editing window. You are correct that we could resize the window but then we'd spend a lot of time making the window bigger and smaller. And—when you make it bigger you frequently have to resize some of the fields within the window.

Again, thanks for considering this idea! Joel

I would +1 the need for having larger space for the "journal title," "Book title," and "series title" fields. This is, for my purposes, far too small -- though not changed from the previous version. I would also +1 to having the "publisher" and "place" fields above the "notes," "abstract," and "keywords" fields, as they are necessary to input for a bibliographical reference, while the others are not, i.e., I do not want to have to scroll down to input or to check the data after import. Otherwise, I very much like the new layout.
John